Quote:
Originally Posted by Vissious
Although referencing Guilty Gear has already made you my favorite person on this forum so far, I have to disagree with your argument a bit. Rock, Paper, Scissors is not necessarily an easy out, but maybe a template for how things would go ideally if characters were equally matched in level (not necessarily skill).
For example: Even if a mage is supposed to beat out a warrior in a RPS system, the way it SHOULD be programmed is so that, yes, if a mage can keep the warrior away from him then he should win every time. However, if the warrior is able to get in close, he smashes the mage with ease. Like I said before, the RPS system isn't all bad, but you're definitely right that it shouldn't be the only factor when it comes to class vs class.
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Haha
<3 Guilty Gear, best fighting game ever made.
To be honest, while there might not be any other way to design characters in a MMO ( at the end, I did say something that kind of implied that I'm not even sure if Guilty Gear style characters is possible in a MMO ) because MMOs and fighting games really don't have much in common, what Guilty Gear has done should be admired.
Rock paper scissors is a good initial design choice. It's simple to understand and it works well in practice. But the problem is when people begin discussing classes, idiot jackasses, lazy or incompetent designers or people looking to prevent nerfing of their own class immediately begin shouting down all thoughtful discussion by saying "rock beats scissors, stop whining and go find paper." This is exactly what happened in WoW, especially within the year following release, but a lot of good discussion that could've helped to balance the game was preempted by people who were too lazy to formulate their own arguments. In addition, because nobody actually bothers to designate what class is rock or papers or scissors, when an overpowered class like a shaman appears and proponents of the shaman start yelling rock paper scissors, it's very difficult to argue against them, especially as you find that in one thread, they are referring to themselves as rock and the next as scissors.
By the way, somebody earlier mentioned that gear makes a difference. This is true. But the problem is, if the system really is rock paper scissors, than it doesn't matter if rock goes all out in gearing up against paper, paper will still with much less effort put into gearing up to secure his advantage against rock.
While rock paper scissors does provide a good initial design template, perhaps even the only viable design template, the problem is that in realization, rock paper scissors is highly flawed and proves cumbersome. The worst thing about rock paper scissors is that it prevents crucial in depth analysis of classes and abilities simply because rock should always beat scissors. But MMOs are not designed to be this simple and neither should the basic premise. Finally, because nobody bothers to say what class is rock or paper or scissors, there's nothing preventing a class from becoming all three.