DP Skills Elyos VS Asmodians

[chaosdruid]

The Asmodian Mage ability is just Godly. If you've played FFXI, it's like Chainspell + Manafont. I think casting quick for no mana is very OP in any situation.

As for the Warrior one, in my opinion, Asmodians got the good end again. 30% extra attack power at level 1, which is when we get these moves, raises damage by a pathetic amount. Whereas a 450'ish instant heal that does 450 damage to your enemy is clutch in an "Oh @#$%" situation.

Originally Posted by Marchosias

The Asmo priest seems absurdly underpowered in comparison... You've got a 1000 health DOT heal vs. a 2000 damage shield? You can still out-damage the DOT and kill the person with it on, a shield gives you another 2000 health whether you're at full health or 1% It's MUCH better in clutch situations.

QFT, couldn't've said it better.

The Scout one is iffy to me. It all depends on what a "normal" evasion rating for a Scout is. Asmodians get their evasion doubled and double magic resistance, but Elyos will dodge all physical attacks (maybe physical projectiles as well) and still be vulnerable to magic. Seems like the two are actually kinda balanced.

All in all I'd have to say the Elyos got the good end. Who cares if everyone else dies, their healers can't be touched.

[Midgarsormr]

Originally Posted by chaosdruid

The Asmodian Mage ability is just Godly. If you've played FFXI, it's like Chainspell + Manafont. I think casting quick for no mana is very OP in any situation.

That's what it reminded me of. Although Asmodian's got jipped, that skill alone is supremely powerful and enough to cover the flaws.

[Marchosias]

See, this is where I think it might get a little hazy in the translation. When I hear "increased 100%" in reference to % chance abilities I interpret it as increasing that value to 100%, rather than doubling, even though the literal interpretation would be doubling. Looking at it from a balancing perspective though I would assume doubling is more likely, in which case I suppose it depends on your base stats... if you resist 30% and evade 30% then is 60% chance to avoid any damage better than 100% chance to avoid all physical and the same 30% chance to avoid magic? I'd say in this situation the 100/30 is definitely superior, but again, it depends on actual numbers. With as little information as we get to support these skills, it's really hard to say.

Also, Chaos, I would hope that this 400 some damage scales and isn't a static 400... obviously that'll kill anything early on and not do a whole lot end-game... assuming it's set in the middle. On either extreme it's even more imbalanced. Which of the warrior skills is better, or whether they're balanced, depends entirely on how each ability scales.

Originally Posted by Midgarsormr

That's what it reminded me of. Although Asmodian's got jipped, that skill alone is supremely powerful and enough to cover the flaws.

Stop saying they got jipped. Without raw numbers to support these neither the scout nor warrior specials are even remotely guessable as to how they balance, and the mage one (we can judge it since it's both percents), is entirely situational.

[Midgarsormr]

Originally Posted by Marchosias

Stop saying they got jipped. Without raw numbers to support these neither the scout nor warrior specials are even remotely guessable as to how they balance, and the mage one (we can judge it since it's both percents), is entirely situational.

Well, sure. Everything is entirely situational. However, more situations occur over others, which can be looked at meaning the faster situation is more important. Having skills that will help you only 10% of the time aren't as good or rewarding as the skills that will help you 50% of the time. Asmodian's seem to have gotten that 10%.

[Intaki]

Dont mind Asmodian being "jipped", like to be a underdog and still owning the other race. Give a little more satifaction by doing so. But dont get me wrong i dont want that unbalance like it was with (RFOnline) Bellino dodge which dodge everything and i mean EVERYTHING ALL the time. And their MAU ("gundam"-suit) OMG dont even wanna go in to that. Just make ppl angry.

[Endrance]

Originally Posted by chaosdruid

The Asmodian Mage ability is just Godly. If you've played FFXI, it's like Chainspell + Manafont. I think casting quick for no mana is very OP in any situation.

Chainspell took 30 seconds and really made you have no cooldown and about 1 second delay, while the skill itself lasted 30 seconds. Now look at Aion... the Skill itself lasts a whole 10 seconds. Imagine a Spell taking 5 seconds to cast, it would now take 2,5 seconds, so you would be able to get of 3-4 Spells instead of 2. Elyos get 75% of their MP back which pretty much means... it's much better over the longer term probably. Well... it all depends on the Spellcosts and cooldowns.

I'm personally rather surprised about the Elyos Priests Stoneskin III, while Asmodian only get a pretty weak looking Regen (which has the worse effect AND only heals you for 1000, while the Stoneskin-like Skill protects to 100% from 2000 damage). Infact Asmodian should, if they get a Regeneration Skill, heal MORE instead of less with it. lol

Well but overall... it doesn't really look like it's actually going to be balanced like this. I smell Nerfs/Buffs incoming. If they wanted to make the DP Skills different by race... the difference shouldn't be that large and not Job-dependant. Sucks to be Asmodian Priest or Elyos Ranger right now. Even if it would be balanced... it would still suck. lol

[Szaman]

Originally Posted by chaosdruid

As for the Warrior one, in my opinion, Asmodians got the good end again. 30% extra attack power at level 1, which is when we get these moves, raises damage by a pathetic amount. Whereas a 450'ish instant heal that does 450 damage to your enemy is clutch in an "Oh @#$%" situation.

At lvl 1 it may be great, but later on as the character will get to xxxxx HP it won't mean a thing.
And we can bet, thet low lvl PvP won't be very popular.

[Marchosias]

Originally Posted by Midgarsormr

Well, sure. Everything is entirely situational. However, more situations occur over others, which can be looked at meaning the faster situation is more important. Having skills that will help you only 10% of the time aren't as good or rewarding as the skills that will help you 50% of the time. Asmodian's seem to have gotten that 10%.

Lol, that's not what I meant by situational at all... one is clearly better for PvP and the other for PvE. You think that elyos mage is going to use its DP to get mana back while soloing? not likely. In small groups? not likely. It'll be used more to reduce down time than anything else. The only time the Elyos mage is going to get actual usefulness out of this is if they want to either a) burn high mana, high damage skills very quickly in PvP or b) fight an endurance PvE boss fight. Asmodian mage is going to be a lot better for PvP in general, because in PvE you're always going to need to watch aggro and the tendency with half cast time and no mana cost is to go all-out, which is contrary to aggro-management. So basically... Elyos for PvE, Asmo for PvP in terms of mage, that's what I meant by situational... all the other classes are basically made for use in the same situations, thus the "situational" point I brought up earlier is irrelevant to everyone but the mage.

They did get jipped on priest. Overall pretty even I'd say, though.

[Birdman]

Originally Posted by Marchosias

Stop saying they got jipped.

YEAH STOP IT MIDGAR STOP!!

[Infinity]

Originally Posted by Marchosias

However... the scout, and maybe this is just the wording, for the asmodians appears to be the Elyos plus resistance... The elyos says they evade all physical attacks and then the asmo says it increases evasion 100%, as well as resistance... Again, it might just be the wording, but it seems pretty clearly one-sided.

I'm pretty sure the elyos scout evades all physical attacks, the Amodian one only increases evasion in that regard (but also increases defenses and such to other things) I would say that they are balanced.

As far as most the others, I would say it will depend on what situation (PvE(boss), PvP, Soloing/Grouping EXP, etc) you are in, but as far as best overall I'd just go along with what most everyone else has said.

Infinity

[aznkenshin]

Originally Posted by Infinity

I'm pretty sure the elyos scout evades all physical attacks, the Amodian one only increases evasion in that regard (but also increases defenses and such to other things) I would say that they are balanced.

As far as most the others, I would say it will depend on what situation (PvE(boss), PvP, Soloing/Grouping EXP, etc) you are in, but as far as best overall I'd just go along with what most everyone else has said.

Infinity

Not only that, I've noticed that all classes, except Clerics, have DP skills that complement their weakness. Or, should I say, "replace" or fill in their weakness.

[Marchosias]

How so, Kenshin? The Templar's weakness of attack is "filled in" by the AP buff, but the Gladiator will already have high AP and high health. This is more complimenting its strength. Furthermore, the assassin and ranger will both probably have relatively high evasion. I suppose you could say it's compensating for "weak armor," but I would argue more that it's complimenting their already high evasion.

I could see the Elyos mage's mana recovery as complimenting a weakness in that they probably run out *relatively* quickly, but then the asmo mage is definitely complimenting its strenght of massive damage quick.

Seems to me like the DP skills are more about highlighting strengths than compensating for weaknesses... otherwise you'd see mages with armor buffs, fighters with buff to resistance/immunity to movement impairing effects, etc. etc.

[Karukan]

Here are my thoughts..

The warrior ones both could be put to good use. The Elyos one would be something you would want to pop early to mid fight to try and get the advantage while the Asmodian one would likely be used to take out someone on the brink of dying or swinging a tied fight torward the end.

The scout ones aren't that bad. The Elyos' skill will be better if they are facing melee but useless if they are fighting a mage. Where the Asmodian's skill is not quite as powerful, but it will help no matter what class you are fighting.

The mage one seems obvious, with the Elyos one being great for PvE and the Asmodian one being great for PvP...which they are, but what if the PvP fight is a long drawn out one? that 75% mana would come in handy instead of being a sitting duck w/o mana...or what if while PvEing on your Asmo Mage you get an add an need to bust out some dmg quickly to keep from dying? It's all in the way you think about it.

And with the cleric skill it seems to be massively 1 sided. If you read carefully the Elyos skill absorbs 2000 dmg off of EACH HIT apparently. So if you get hit 15 times for 2000+ dmg then you will have absorbed 30,000 dmg...if you got hit 30 then you absorb 60,000 with no limit. The Asmodian's skill is however capped at 1000 health...assuming you live to get it all.

They are all pretty different from race to race but thats a good thing. They should both have their unique playstyle and all characters should have strenths and weaknesses that others can take advantage of and that others will feel the wrath of. Some classes make PvE a breeze but blow in PvP and others struggle through PvE just so they can dominate in PvP. Thats the way things are supposed to be.

So please don't start calling out the nerf bat and bs like that already. The only people that generally do that are the people that usually suck with any character they play and wanting to blame it on the 'pvp system' or the game itself. If you want to play in a happy, fair for all environment try Hello Kitty Online...

[Chaos_Theory]

Don't DoT spells exist in this game? If so, the asmodian priest skill is much more helpful if there is some massive degen going on. DoT isn't attacking so the elyos skill won't do jack in that situation. If that isnt the case then the elyos preist skill seems to be the stronger of the two.

The asmodian mage skill imo is way to strong you can cast w/e high level,long casting time, destructive spells you have w/ no mana and with an increase to how fast you cast them.

Asmodians got the better half of the scout skill imo because you have an increased defense to everything while the elyos only get "perfect dodge" to physical attacks. The only reason 1 would use these skills if they are about to die meaning any mage can most likley come along and kill them easily.

The elyos warrior gets the better skill imo simply because of its longevity in a battle while the asmodian skill is better when trying to finish off an opponent in small pvp.

Why does it seem to me that the Elyos skills are for more pve and the asmodian skills are more for pvp?

[Fuz]

A bit early to delve this deep into it, I think. I mean it's fine to debate how these skills weigh against eachother, but it's way to soon to say who and why a class is underpowered based on just this information. It's also stated that these are only level 1, and we don't know which aspects of them and to which magnitude they're scaled as they increase.

Faster cast speed is only as good as the rest of your spells. No MP consumption is only worth the amount of MP you would normally spend during it.