Who actually enjoys grinding?

[Tofi]

Originally Posted by Venue

The main difference between us is that you define the skill from the time the one player stand against the other, i define the skill also when someone is able to lock a xp spot , grind faster and more efficiently than any other, having the right classes in the party structure, finishing dungeons and killing bosses his opponent cannot and as you say having "non-gameplay advantages".
In a matter fact having that many "non-gameplay advantages" that will not even give a chance to his opponent to face him. Mmo are about the character building and you will realize that the ones you call "non-gameplay advantages" are produced only from right gameplay which is way more than being skilled in key pressing that is only just another factor.

Well I for one can understand what you mean, I just don't like it. Let's see an example from some of the "top" MMOs:
-WoW: you're against a full pvp geared 12 years old, with your simple quest geared character, let's say, he's a warlock he can bind every key on his keyboard to one of his DoTs, then smash his head as hard as he can on the said keyboard like "RAAARGH", even then you have no chance of winning (it's really easy to get that PvP gear, and even if it wasn't I'd like a little chance of winning)
-Eve online: it's a really complicated game, the first thing you should know, there are no levels, there is money and skills, you obtain both with time, you might make more money if you're smart, but you'll never level up your skills faster, so the person that's been playing for 3 years, will definitely have a much more powerful character than you. (even though I liked that game, it demoralized me greatly)
L2: you'll never beat a much better geared player
And let's see the other end (I only know 1 game that's done this):
AoC: they said (I don't know if they changed this yet) that stats will have a maximum, this means even if you've killed the biggest boss in the game, and got the greatest gear, you'll be just as powerful as someone with a more common gear.
I'd love to see Aion as a game in the middle, having better gear would make you more powerful, but wouldn't insure a win against a "just turned 50 player". I'd like to see your own skills getting you the upper hand, not the gear your character is wearing. Though that's just my opinion, I'm not a big MMO player because I don't have the time to play 8 hours a day, but I'll definitely buy this game.

[danieru]

I'm a FFXI vet so I can appreciate a good grind. Maybe if the last 10 levels were almost reliant on party grinding it would cause more interaction in the community and would help distinguish the noobs from the mature gamers. Playing with people who weren't filling thier role in a party is a great way to decide who you want to befriend for future quests and who you want to avoid. It would only be the last 10 levels till cap but I think it would be a nice change from mindless button mashing on trash mobs and help people really get set up for endgame strategy and party roles.

[Solaire]

I would agree with that.

One of the things I found when playing GW back in the day was the first couple months everybody was doing all the quests and all the missions in groups... then as time wore on, it was people just asking for runs places. (Which, I had my warrior/ranger making a ton of money with double sprints. ;P I could even do the beacon run down the mountains to that dwarf city, I forget the name of now. )

It's similar in WoW now. There are still same level groups that get together and do the instances. But it gets to the point that it takes so long and everybody is in such a rush that they'd rather just have themselves power leveled by friends.

I think Aion needs to put xp caps on instances or something, to avoid the same issue in WoW. Sure, have a high level run you through for a chance at a drop in a lowbie instance your really want, but then have the low level only get 1/10th of the xp you'd get from going with a same level group.

At least, I'm assuming there will be low level instances and not just end game ones. Going through instances with same level groups teaches new people to MMOs how to play in a group, and it's a great experience for learning your class, and meeting folks.

[Calindor]

Aion isnt instance based...but they could have a system similar to L2, where when there is a huge level difference in the party you get little to no exp.

[Endrance]

Originally Posted by Calindor

Aion isnt instance based...but they could have a system similar to L2, where when there is a huge level difference in the party you get little to no exp.

Pretty much any MMORPG uses that kind of system.

[Solaire]

Originally Posted by Calindor

Aion isnt instance based...but they could have a system similar to L2, where when there is a huge level difference in the party you get little to no exp.

Ah, I thought it was, because I saw movies that said there were instances, looked like a 6 person group. I know the game itself is zoned instead of seamless, but how big are the zones? Like GW zones, or like WoW, where there's the Kalimdor "zone" and Eastern Kingdoms "zone" (though there's a zoning portal from the BC areas and the original game areas), and Outland.

[LethalGT]

Hey guys..

I got a cool idea.. Let's make a game, where you can seperate the noobs from the pro's!

Other guy: LOL maybe you could add some kind of like system, where you can show your skill by gear?
Another guy: NO WAY! Let's just make it so that it takes so long to get to the highest level that you wanna rip all the hairs out of your scrotum/******l area!!
Other guy: I like the way you think, promoted.


NO.

Leveling sucks balls, I agree it should require SOME time. Max 2 weeks to hit highest level while playing more than casually but not hardcore.

[Starlight]

On ffxi I did a lot of grinding jobs. My huge issue with ffxi is end game gear is hard to obtain unless you have no life and play 24/7 and attend all events. People with jobs, college, children are basicy sol. I love to quest and to read new story line. I just hope getting gear will be something a small team can get together instead of fighting 18+ people for a single item

[c4tastroph3]

As I stated before on other threads, gear gap is what controls how retarded grinds become. If they add new armor/weapons that are better than the top stuff at the time of whatever patch they release, and do this constantly, grinding occurs way more than it did before and it makes fresh vs seasoned a very unbalanced fight.

[Calindor]

There are some instances for storyline quests.

[Dragonprovidence]

I don't really mind, as long as it's not mindless grinding then it's ok. At least give me something like a goal. If it's a quest that says go kill 140 so and so, then it won't bother me so much because I'll feel like there's a purpose. Though the reward better be damn well worth it.

[Venue]

Originally Posted by LethalGT

Leveling sucks balls, I agree it should require SOME time. Max 2 weeks to hit highest level while playing more than casually but not hardcore.

2 weeks is way too much, wont you get exhausted by then?

[Grobyc]

I'm opposed to endless grinding. It's kind of what killed it for me when playing KAL Online and an endless amount of other MMO's. I'm ok with grinding every once in a while but it shouldn't be a requirement. Still, the best system I found was the quest system from WoW. Grinding was still an option to level but there was the alternative of questing. I just hate having to stare at the screen, kill the same mobs, and pretty much want to rip my hair out when other players get to the mob before I did while I was winding up a spell. It doesn't take skill at all, it just takes time. It's more of a test of patience than a test of skill. I don't intend on paying $15 a month to have to stare at the screen and kill the same thing over and over again, if I wanted to do that, I can go back and play the other free MMO's.

[Genjimaru]

I don't mind a bit of grinding here and there, but theres a big difference between grinding for an hour or two and grinding non-stop for days just to get one level.

[twostep]

Originally Posted by LethalGT

Leveling sucks balls, I agree it should require SOME time. Max 2 weeks to hit highest level while playing more than casually but not hardcore.

LOL! you cant be serious...