[Drunk_Monkee]

Hello i'm a level 55 gladiator have always used a spear but i've seen lots of glads with dagger+warhammer and heard it's better for damage is this true and if not or so reasons why. Ty for your opinions . Also with w/e choice you pick some weapons for my level would be nice.

This post has been edited by Drunk_Monkee: 18 November 2011 - 06:52 PM

[Drunk_Monkee]

I just got my debil dagger so that sengthens my decison towards dagger+warhammer :/

[lagevogel]

for pve dual wield mostly is better then spear. For pvp bakarma spear > all ( unless u think u can get that extend spear from that quest where u have to kill opponent guards 30 times or so i dont know )

[Pear]

use a pear

[Jinxied]

Best weapon for glad: Fork

[.Rast]

PVE : a good* DW set > Spear
PVP : Spear > Anything

*Meaning: 2 good weapons, both with a good point damage godstone supported by a full attack armor set.

[lleuwelyn]

pff i use my spear for pve too. Doesnt really matter too much which weapon you use for pve as long as you use your brain a bit. Its not like the mobs are players that act unpredictable like players or so. If you have the spare money to invest in dagger/mace for pve you can do it. But i feel in the end it doesnt matter too much. Being effective in pvp is more important to me.

This post has been edited by lleuwelyn: 19 November 2011 - 12:35 PM

[reflexion]

Spoon: Let's spoon
Fork: fork off

that is all

[Vaux]

Dagger/Mace is a bad idea.

Credits to StingeX :

"noone can give u advice on what setup is BEST, cause everyone made his own experiences. i ll jsut post mine without laying claim of completeness and keeping in mind its only bout PVE:


+ATTACK
+atk is what u search for. i suggest, if u wanna keep ur mace for DW, to get a nice dagger, maybe blue balic LVL50 - easy to make +5/+6 and ofc cause a dagger will help u get ur atkspd to higher then mace+mace. but on the other hand if u sock elementalDMGstones u need to keep mace on mainhand to make its magicboots work on the godstones(elementalGodstones male like ~70%more dmg cause of 770mb).
whatever choice u make at the end: +atk is the bonus to have.

ATKSPDhelp(i calc with 8%atkspd from gaunts, 2 from title and 9 from scroll, 19mace):
mace+mace = 1,2@crit10 ---WORKS
mace+dagger = 1,1@crit10 ---WORKS GOOD!
sword+dagger = 1,1@crit50 (that i would never do cause crit from dagger is being wasted...)
sword+mace = 1,1@crit50 (mace offhand lol no thx)
sword+sword = 1,1@crit50 WORKS GOOD!
mace+sword = 1,1@crit50 WORKS
dagger+mace = 1,0@crit100 (thats the only setup that i would never go with cause mboost from mace gets lost)
dagger+sword = 1,0@crit100 WORKS GOOD!*

*my choice: menoDagger+virhanasword, not too expensive


so its basically (procChance of godstones) vs (critchance + 20% faster hitting) vs (number of strikes per weapon)
if u re a autohitFan keep in mind that Maces are 3strike, while swords are 2strike and daggz are 1strike.


CRIT
u will notice it if u havent yet: if mainhandweapon critHits, then offhand will crit too - ALWAYS!
since I dont wanna change my gear too much i decided not to sock any/more crit into my armors and found that having daggermain+swordoffhand is my style of playing. my ping also varies alot(from 80 up to 250 sometimes - so i cant really time the waeving perfectly at atkspd 1,0) AND with dagger in main and sword in off the dmg doesnt vary too much making DPS VERY STABLE - unlike some dudes running around with atkvarying numbers higher then 80-100, my setup varies only 35atkpoints.

ACCURACY
i some cases accuracy might be important. some bosses are and will be highLVL then players or will just have high stats(1st boss besh likes to dodge alot with me having 2,4k accu...). Dagger main helps there alot too.



my setup:
i loose aggro only vs VERYHIGHDPSsorc or Assa. BUT i m not using any +aggroArmors! yet!"

.............................................

In pve (instances) useing a pole makes u pretty much useless. The only instance that presents any kind of challange this days is EC. From stage 7 up u need to move lot and to be fast. Last thing u want is to be caught in pole animation. In some stages u cant aoe(10.1-10.2)
My curent setup is noble tac dagger/tac sword.

In normal pve(grind normal mobs) i consider pole or gs more usefull since u can use aoe selfheal stigma. WIth this u can get 5-6 mobs and at the end of fight u r full hp. Helps a bit when some nyerk will try to gank u too.

[0____________o]

dont forget, if its aerial combat, youll want to DW for the most part. greatest strength of a spear/gs is KDs, which you dont get in the air. Go DW and youll do better. Though, being melee, youre already severely gimped in the air

[lleuwelyn]

0______________o, on 19 November 2011 - 05:45 PM, said:

dont forget, if its aerial combat, youll want to DW for the most part. greatest strength of a spear/gs is KDs, which you dont get in the air. Go DW and youll do better. Though, being melee, youre already severely gimped in the air

ehmm correction you do get KD's in the air...... they become stuns with no follow up for crippling cut or draining blow. And an extendable polearm is pretty efficient in the air.

[reflexion]

lol, not even aware that he just got trolled, O______________O you got him good

[NovaE]

DW, Pole, GS... doesn´t matter.

It´s all about how you use it and how much you will focus on the type.

A lazy Glad prefers Dual Wield obviously, while a player who really knows how to take routines and weaves with Pole/GS, can reach same DPS(or in few cases even more).

Imo the difference between DW and Pole is just:

Pole/GS - More Instant Burst DMG, constant DPS only with effort
DW - easier constant DPS over time. Also aggro should be easier to get with DW, duo to higher hitrate.

But dependable of your skill and Stigmas with it, each one can be better.

I´m one of the rare ones who use complete Sharp Strike Chain, that´s why I have way different experiences with DPS than others.

This post has been edited by NovaE: 22 November 2011 - 04:43 AM

[Vaux]

DW has nothing to do with being lazy.
Bosses dont get kd, so 4 skills r completly useless, some silence u, gl with auto-atk on pole, in many cases u need to move alot and fast, gl doing that with pole/gs specially if u have ping/lag issues. Ofc u can move and hit and do whatever u want with pole,but ur dps will be neglijable...most grps will prefer a sorc or a ranger instead of u.
Ofc in instances like eso or bt doesnt matter what u use....as i said ec is the only instance that presents a challange this days.
Bottom line is...u play on EU server, where 99% of ppl cant pve unless ncsoft provides a drastic nerf of bosses, so they pvp. If u like dw use it, if u like criting 5-6k dmg in 1 swing use it, if u want to use taunt only 1 time every 30 min use it. If u dont want to use dw, get some abyss gear,slot it with acc/hp/crit and the only grps u will get is when ppl cant find sorc/sm/ranger/sin/dps cleric.

[Ecto]

NovaE, on 21 November 2011 - 07:18 AM, said:

DW, Pole, GS... doesn´t matter.

A lazy Glad prefers Dual Wield oviously, while a player who really knows how to take routines and weaves with Pole/GS, reach same DPS(or in few cases even more).

Imo the difference between DW and Pole is just:

Pole - More InstanT Burst DMG(better for pro Glad´s), constant DPS only with effort
DW - easier constant DPS over time(better for lazy Glad´s). Also aggro should be easier to get with DW, duE to higher hitrate.

My bullsh1t detector is going feckin nuts here mate XD. Lets just list the corrections, and this is factual not some hairy fairy boy in a room with stuffed animals and warm milk philosophy.

1) In terms in of equivalent gear (i.e. SW Spear vs SW Dual wield, both +0) dual wield is miles ahead. I would go so far as to bet a gladiator using a +0 sw spear on 3 targets would be "outdps'd" by a dual wield gladiator on single target.

2) Saying dual wield is for lazy gladiators is also bullnyerk, and that is simply down to attack spead. Dual wielding requires better timed weaves and at a higher frequency.

3) "DW, Pole, GS... doesn´t matter." - Also nonsense, it is simply Dual Wield > Greatsword > Polearm for pve dps. Tested, verified.


Don't believe me? aionrainmeter.tk

The PVP discussion bit is easier.

Best weapons for trolling sins with - Dual Wield
Best weapons for actual pvp - spear

This post has been edited by Ectooo: 22 November 2011 - 02:01 AM

[NovaE]

Sure you say it´s bullnyerk, because you use DW.

But fact is I saw rarely DW Glad´s who do more DPS or burst than me with Pole(mate used DPS Meter and showed me few times).

That´s what I mean, If Players can´t play with it they won´t do more DPS anyways. And all DW yout vid´s are also a joke, with Pole I did way more DMG/DPS yet...

You forgot, not everyone use the handicapping mixed PvP Stigmabuild, that´s what makes the difference and why people say DW is better without even a real compare.

[Ecto]

NovaE, on 22 November 2011 - 02:36 AM, said:

Sure you say it´s bullnyerk, because you use DW.

But fact is I saw rarely DW Glad´s who do more DPS or burst than me with Pole(mate used DPS Meter and showed me few times).

That´s what I mean, If Players can´t play with it they won´t do more DPS anyways. And all DW yout vid´s are also a joke, with Pole I did way more DMG/DPS yet...

You forgot, not everyone use the handicapping mixed PvP Stigmabuild, that´s what makes the difference and why people say DW is better without even a real compare.

Firstly,trust me I make no unfounded claims.

Secondly, do a little more research before making accusations, 99% of time I am in Polearm-PvP build, tendon, beserking, slaughter, ankle snare etc, truth be told I only have whirling strike and sharpstrike (for polearm pvp purposes) from the dual wield tree and never have both slotted.

Thirdly you got it 100% wrong, I am not saying DW is higher dps because that is what I use in PVE, ain't part of any fan club. It is much more like I use DW in pve because it is the undisputed winner in single target dps, and, in some cases, higher dps regardless of number of targets. Sentence order important. I don't know what sh1tty glads you been playing with that can not keep up with a 2handed weapon user in terms of pve dps while using dual wield, long story short they are giving you seriously false illusions. Rather than a "few mates" telling what is the craic and what is not, I run the meter myself, against +15 BG spear gladiators, +15 Eternal Balic Greatsword gladiators, and everytime my +4 dual wield wins without struggle.

If you wanna put further argument very happy to up a dual wield dps vid and you can too. Or I can just say I told you so now ^^


PS - WTB L90 stones

This post has been edited by Ectooo: 22 November 2011 - 04:12 AM

[Vaux]

So a buddy of urs showed u how cool u wave a pole, let me guess...hitting dummies in sanctum....and u saw some vids on youtube. Now u consider urself an expert. In a real case scenario aka fighting something that fights back,haveing 900+/800+ atk, 700+ crit, 2300 acc, 0.8 atk speed it's way better then using pole/gs. I guess u will never understand this, since u r too busy waveing a pole and feeling good about yourself.

[NovaE]

Vaux, on 22 November 2011 - 04:19 AM, said:

So a buddy of urs showed u how cool u wave a pole, let me guess...hitting dummies in sanctum....and u saw some vids on youtube. Now u consider urself an expert. In a real case scenario aka fighting something that fights back,haveing 900+/800+ atk, 700+ crit, 2300 acc, 0.8 atk speed it's way better then using pole/gs. I guess u will never understand this, since u r too busy waveing a pole and feeling good about yourself.

No I meant in Instances, in a group... you know .

And If you would read, you would see that I don´t say DW is worse or so, just a question of builds and gameplay.
And what? With Pole and all buffs you can have like 2k+ Att and such and not that much less Atkspd.

My feelings aren´t hurt if someone prefers DW(lol), but this is a DISCUSSION, so I do nothing wrong.


@Ectooo: When I reactivated my account next week and refused weapon, I might do it

[Ecto]

You are wrong. Completely.

You said: "pole gs dual wield doesn't matter... ...But dependable of your skill and Stigmas with it, each one can be better... ...A lazy Glad prefers Dual Wield obviously, while a player who really knows how to take routines and weaves with Pole/GS, can reach same DPS(or in few cases even more)."

This is crap mate, I'm sorry, it is just crap Dual wield wins in terms of dps, its pretty simple and widely accepted. You're sterring the topic starter/question asker in the wrong direction. If you did more dps with your polearm than some other gladiators either A) Your polearm is considerably better item (eg 55 eternal vs 50 fabled) B) They are nyerk and my dog can weave better than them or C) Both. Re-read my above post to save me typing out the same argument again.

As a further note, you are basing all of this on some mates and their mates' mates dps meter readings. Try it for yourself, weaving properly with dual wield is considerably harder than doing it with a polearm.

And lastly, take the bloody youtube video out of your sig, this topic is twice as long as needs be cos of that crap. Put a link to it if you wanna advertise.

This post has been edited by Ectooo: 22 November 2011 - 05:58 AM